Please join us – all are welcome and no prior knowledge is required.
We meet ONLINE twice every week (every Thursday 8pm and Sunday 3pm UK time).
We meet IN-PERSON on the first Sunday of every month at 2pm UK time and this meeting is also livestreamed on Zoom.
Meetings often start with some Silence followed by some readings, a talk and some questions. The initial silence is a wonderful opportunity for stillness and to put the teachings into practice.
After the meeting there is an opportunity to stay and connect with other people attending the meeting.
Some people have informed me of their view that in full liberation there is no appearance of the body, mind and world, but that this full liberation, called videhamukti, only occurs when the body dies. As long as the body lives, they say, the appearance of the world continues, this being called Jivanmukti (liberation whilst alive as a person or jiva). For the Jivanmukti, the appearance of the body, mind and world continue, but they are known to be an illusion.
The Jnani, they say, will continue to experience pleasure and pain, etc, until the body dies. Some say this means that some ignorance is retained for the jivanmukti and ignorance is only completely dispelled when the body dies after jivanmukti, which again is called videhamukti (liberation without the body, ie. The state of liberation once the body has died – note if this is true, then there are 2 forms of liberation, which itself is a contradiction to non-duality – ie. there cannot be 2 different forms of non-dual liberation by definition, for that would be inherently dualistic).
This is not Shankara’s view at all. He specifically states this view is not correct in many places throughout his writing. Incidentally Sri Ramana Maharshi also explains how this view is not correct too and is in full agreement with Shankara.
In this post I will demonstrate that Shankara has the following view:
1) for the liberated sage (jnani) there is no appearance of the body, mind or world – there is no appearance of a body, there is no appearance or experience of pleasure or of pain, and there is not even any experience or appearance of time and space for the jnani
2) this liberation does not occur only once the body has died – the implication is that whilst others may perceive the jnani to have a body, to experience pleasure, pain, etc, to experience time and space, this is only the view of the ignorant onlooker. The Jnani has a different ‘experience’, namely they do not perceive samsara, the world, pleasure, pain, time, space or a body – they only ‘experience’ the ever-blissful self, which is one, homogenous and ultimately beyond all experience, all conception and all description.
3) Shankara explains that the appearance of the body (and mind and world) is an effect of ignorance, and that the cessation of ignorance cannot depend on an action such as the death of the body (yes, death of the body is an action, and Shankara famously and repeatedly taught that actions cannot lead to removal of ignorance or liberation). Conversely, if the body mind and world appear, that is an indicator that ignorance is still in effect, for these are the hallmarks of duality, samsara, jivahood and suffering.
4) Moreoever, the body, being an effect of ignorance, cannot itself remove ignorance by dying. Ignorance is the cause, the body-appearance is a consequence of ignorance. Any changes to the effect cannot effect the root cause, no, rather the root cause of duality has to be removed, and when that occurs, any effects dependent on the cause will naturally fall away.
Shankara comments on the nature of liberation
In Shankara’s commentary on the Brahma Sutra 1.1.4 Shankara makes several definitive points about the nature of liberation. In this part of the commentary, his main aim is to show that the Self is not attained through any actions or thoughts, but through Jnana or knowledge (which he explains is not a thought or understanding). However in making his arguments, he also makes some other points about the nature of liberation.
Bodilessness is liberation
First he says that there is no body in liberation, that the jnani is without a body. He uses the word अशरीरत्व (aśarīratva) which literally means ‘the state of being without a body’ (sarira = body; a- is the negating prefix, -tva denotes the state of being, similar to the English suffix ‘-ness’) or ‘bodilessness’.
Shankara writes:
Hence it is proved that asiriratva (bodilessness), which is liberation, is eternal and different from the results of action…it is all pervasive like space, devoid of all modifications, ever happy, without parts and self-effulgent by nature. This is that bodilessness, called liberation, where the idea of the three periods of time does not exist, and the virtuous and unvirtuous deeds cease along with their effects, as stated in the scriptures…
We can clearly see in the text above that Shankara is stating the Jnani is without a body, and also does not experience any actions, any effects of actions, nor do they experience any concept of the three periods of time (past, present and future).
Of course, this teaching is given by Shankara repeatedly thoughout his commentarial works where he states the transactional reality (vyvaharika) only exists for the ignorant/ unrealised, and for the Jnani, there is only the Ultimate Truth (paramarthika). Shankara also writes this in his non-commentarial works, such Upadesa Saharsri, as follows:
All this world is unreal and proceeds from ignorance, because it is seen only by one afflicted by ignorance
Sri Shankara, Upadesa Sahasri 17.20
and also here:
Having thus effaced the triad consisting of dreamless sleep, dream and waking experience, one crosses over the great sea of ignorance. For he is then established in his own Self, void of all attributes of the empirical world, pure, enlightened, and by his very nature liberated.
Sri Shankara, Upadesa Sahasri 17.58
and also here:
Of me who am ever-liberated, pure, rock-firm and changeless, not subject to modification, immortal, indestructible and so without a body, there is no hunger or thirst or grief or delusion or old age or death. For I am bodiless…
Sri Shankara, Upadesa Sahasri 13.3-13.4
Bodilessness has nothing to do with the death of the body
But perhaps one could argue that this bodiless state of liberation only occurs when the body dies, ie. in so-called Videhamukti, but that the body persists in jivanmukti? Shankara addresses this very point in the same commentary on Brahma Sutra verse 1.1.4, where he writes the following:
Opponent: Suppose we argue that this bodilessness comes when the body falls [dies], but it cannot be so for the person still living?
Vedantin: Not so, for the idea of having a body is the result of ignorance. Unless it be through the ignorance of identifying the Self with the body, there can be no having a body for the self. And we have said that the bodilessness of the Self is eternal, since it is not a product of action.
Shankara is explaining 2 points here, firstly that the notion of the body itself is downstream from ignorance, ie. that the body only persists due to ignorance, and when ignorance has gone, so has the body. Therefore one does not need to wait for the body to die to become ‘bodiless’. These kinds of misconceptions arise from the strong identification of being a body in the first place.
His second point is that the death of the body is an action, and so cannot be responsible for the eternal state of bodilessness, which is liberation and the Self (note that earlier in this commentary Shankara has already made the point that all actions lead to effects which themselves are finite and impermanent, and so action cannot lead to something permanent such as the eternal state of bodilessness which is our true nature – ie. Shankara has argued that no action or karma can lead to liberation or moksha)
The Jnani’s worldly experience doesn’t continue as before
But surely, one could argue, the jnani has the same essential worldly experience as the ajnani (the unenlightened or ignorant one)? Don’t we see the Jnani walking, taking, eating, laughing, getting annoyed, etc? Shankara denies this – he goes on to say the following, again in his commentary on Brahma Sutra 1.1.4:
..it is established that the liberated one has no body even whilst living…hence one who has realised his own identity with Brahmancannot continue to experience the world (samsara) as before, whereas the one who experiences the world (samsara) as before has not realised his identity as Brahman. Thus it is all beyond criticism.
And again Shankara writes in his commentary on Brahma Sutra 1.1.4:
Opponent:…it is a patent fact that even one who has heard of Brahman continues to have his mundane life just as before?
Vedantin: To this the answer is being given: for one who has realised the state of the oneness of the Self and Brahman, it cannot be proved that his mundane life continues just as before, for this contradcits the knowledge of the oneness of Brahman and the Self…hence it is stated in the scriptures ‘Happiness and sorrow do not touch one who has become definitely without a body’ [Chandogya Upanishad 8.7.1]
We can see here the objection is raised that surely it is an obvious fact that the jnani experiences their mundane life just as before. Shankara denies this, stating firstly that this cannot be proved and secondly that this notion contradicts the scriptures and concept of non-dual realisation. Shankara in the above comments also explains that the Jnani does not experience any worldly happiness or sorrow, an idea consistent with what Shankara wrote earlier, namely there are no actions or effects of actions (such as happiness or sorrow) in the Self.
We see Sri Ramana explain the same in this picture quote below, when he is commenting on another writing of Shankara’s:
If you are interested to see how Sri Ramana Maharshi, Gaudapada and Suresvara give the same teachings please see this post here:
The Śrutis have emphatically denied that the pluralistic world of minerals, mountains, trees, animals and human beings together constituting the world of multiplicity* exist even as a trace in the pure Reality.
The great seers, saints and sages have corroborated this with their personal experience. When there is no duality as the devotee and the Lord, how can the devotee say he is experiencing God?
When the dream merges [Tom: ie. dissolves and disappears] itself in the waking, how can the waker say that the dreamer is different from the waker?
So too when you transcend this place of Consciousness and wake up to the plane of God-consciousness, how can you experience duality or multiplicity? This is what all Śrutis declare.
~ Swami Chinmayananda, commentary on Aparoksanubhuti (a text by Shankara), verse 47
*Swamiji defines plurality and multiplicity as being the world of objects, such as minerals mountains trees animals and human beings. He states that not even a trace of these exist in the reality. He is following the definition of multiplicity given by the Upanishads and by Shankara when he writes this, both of whom are unequivocal that this world of multiplicity and plurality refers to the appearance of objects such as mountains trees etc, and these only appear to exist due to ignorance, and cease to appear to exist once ignorance has been removed.
When Swamiji explains that ‘not a trace’ of multiplicity exists in the reality, meaning in self-realization, when only reality is there, nothing else, no ignorance, he is also copying the language of Shankara and the Upanishads who also say ‘not a trace’ of multiplicity exists in self-realisation.
In this Satsang, Tom shares one of Sri Ramana Maharshi’s higher teachings- a revelation that speaks to the heart of nonduality and the end of seeking. This is not a teaching for all times or all people, but for those ready to step beyond all concepts of “me” and “you,” “doing” and “becoming.”
Here, Tom points to the essence: there is nothing to see, no one to practice, no separate listener or speaker. What remains is only that – pure peace, bliss, and fullness. Nothing is gained or discovered, because nothing was ever lost. This is the Good News: only the Beloved Is. Only Ramana.
All that appears – the universe, body, mind, and world – is not ultimately real. Only unconditional love remains. Forms and teaching may guide one out of Maya, but what abides beyond cannot be grasped. And yet, all is perfectly well.
All is well, and there is nothing to fear. For the sincere devotee and earnest seeker, this Satsang is a glimpse of a very high rung on the ladder of awakening – a tender, uncompromising call to recognize that only the Self has ever been.
This video was recorded live during a Satsang meeting with Tom Das on December 21, 2025, and put together by volunteers.
There is a great power, and it is you. When attention is preoccupied with the body, mind, and world, the simple truth of who we really are is forgotten. As long as we take ourselves to be only a separate person, this living reality remains veiled.
In this Satsang welcome, Tom gently invites us – through presence, words, silence, and heartfelt praise of Sri Ramana Maharshi – to lay down our ignorance and return home to the power we truly are, beyond all delusion. Here, you are welcomed to rediscover that your deepest nature is not limited, not broken, and never separate, but the very source of peace and clarity itself.
This video was recorded live during a Satsang meeting with Tom Das on October 30, 2025, and put together by volunteers.
In this video, an intimate exchange between Tom and a Satsang member turns the heavy feeling of “I don’t know who I am” into a doorway rather than a defeat.
*Video overview Tom responds with compassionate clarity, drawing on Ramana Maharshi, Jesus, and the wisdom of the three gunas—tamas, rajas, and sattva—to illuminate how true seeking actually works.
“The devil hid the treasure of self‑knowing in the one place we don’t like to look,” Tom says, pointing us back to the heart rather than the mind’s endless strategies.
*From doom‑scrolling to the heart The conversation exposes how the mind uses body, mind, and world—like an addiction to our phones and doom‑scrolling—to chase self‑knowledge where it can never be found.
Tom invites us to “shed” the body‑mind‑world orientation and enter the inner sanctuary of the heart, where silence, pure spirit, and a living sense of Presence are discovered.
*The taste of true power As this sanctuary is touched, there is a palpable power within that is not separate from who we are, and this taste naturally weakens the habit of searching outside for answers.
The dialogue gently encourages resting in this inner power instead of trying to fix or complete ourselves through external experiences and roles.
*Healing through the three gunas Tom also speaks practically about the gunas: when we feel tamasic—heavy, depressed, defeated—it can be wise to engage in rajasic, creative, playful activity to soften old wounds and frozen energy.
From there, we become more available to sattvic clarity—calm, peaceful, and quietly blissful—which reveals what we are authentically seeking and already are in essence.
*For those on the path This Satsang is for anyone who feels lost in self‑doubt, tired of seeking, or trapped in the mind’s “doom‑scroll,” and is ready to turn inward to the heart.
Happy New Year. This video is from the first Satsang of 2026. After an hour of shared silence, Tom gently invites us to remain rooted in that sacred quiet — the essence of Sri Ramana Maharshi’s highest teaching of silent presence.
May this stillness, and Tom’s steady guidance, reveal the truth of who you are: beyond thought, beyond feeling — Aham Brahmasmi — “I am that.”
This is known only by the one who is truly quiet.
This video was recorded live during a Satsang meeting with Tom Das on January 1, 2026 and put together by volunteers.
This Satsang arose after an hour of silent self-inquiry, with the teaching emerging from a settled recognition rather than from theory. Tom begins by revisiting the familiar Advaita pointer, “We are not the doer, we are not the enjoyer”.
He then reads Question and Answer 13 from the text Self Enquiry in the The Collected Works of Sri Ramana Maharshi, turning attention to Ramana’s uncompromising instruction on action, agency, and the Self. The emphasis is on the mind resting in its source so completely that even subtle movements such as “Is this right? Is that wrong? Should I do this or that?” are seen as vasanic ripples to be noticed and not followed.
From here, Tom speaks about Ramana’s “indifference” not as dullness or avoidance, but as the natural non-grasping of a heart absorbed in the Divine. When happiness is tasted at the core, the world is not rejected, yet its pull softens; functioning continues, prarabdha unfolds, but the “I am the one doing” thought is not given a foothold.
For seasoned seekers, this meeting points less to managing life and more to a radical, practical abidance: staying as the Self while activity and karma play out on the surface. The flavour is one of resolute devotion — Bhakti expressed as a quiet refusal to leave the Self for the mind’s next concern, and a willingness to let love of God outshine every other priority.
This video was recorded live during a Satsang meeting with Tom Das on January 1, 2026 and put together by volunteers.
In this Satsang, Tom offers a nuanced and insightful teaching on “Siddhis” — a Sanskrit term meaning “accomplishment,” “perfection,” or “attainment.” Siddhis often refer to extraordinary abilities or yogic powers said to arise through deep spiritual practice, such as levitation, invisibility, or telepathy. Tom explores how these phenomena are sometimes sought by spiritual seekers or arise spontaneously as by-products of genuine practice.
This video was recorded live during a Satsang meeting with Tom Das on November 20th , 2025 and put together by volunteers.
This article is an excerpt from a much longer article which you can view here, that gives further quotes on this same topic from others including Sri Ramana Maharshi, Sri Shankara, Yoga Vasistha and Ribhu Gita. The original article also expands on the disclaimer below and makes some suggestions as how to best appraoch these teachings.
A warning/disclaimer
The teachings that are given below, whilst they are open to anyone, they are very radical in their nature. It is not recommended that you read them if you are not an earnest seeker of liberation or if your mind is likely to be destabilised by a more radical notion of the nature of the universe or what liberation looks like.
We will see that these same exact teachings have been given for many centuries, but traditionally these teachings would only be given to a prepared mind, a mind prepared by devotion, faith and loving surrender. This infuses the mind and heart with an energy of peace, calm and loving kindness and happiness. It is this stable peaceful mind that is most able to receive these teachings, although it is possible there can be some exceptions to this.
Some people can find these teachings quite distressing and destablising and the author of this post takes no responsibility for providing this information to you that has been traditionally written about and taught for many centuries and is already in the public domain.
Sri Suresvara – Shankara’s student and protege
Suresvara was a devoted student of Shankara who wrote the treatise Naishkarmya Siddhi (NS, you can download the text for free in this link) as well as some commentaries on Shankara’s works. As expected, he explains exactly the same things as Gaudapada and Shankara do above. We will see that Suresvara explains the following key points in his writings:
That the world only appears due to ignorance
The world itself is a form of ignorance
The world refers to phenomenal arisings, also known as objects, and includes the body and the mind (thoughts, feelings, emotions, etc) and gross objects such as trees, stars, rivers, etc.
Ignorance itself is ultimately not a real thing that ever exists
When (apparent) ignorance is removed by self-knowledge, the world also no longer appears due to its cause (ignorance) being removed
This world therefore no longer arises or appears to the self-realised Jnani.
If we read carefully, we will see that Suresvara is not saying that the Jnani continues to see the world but sees it to be an illusion, and he is also not saying the Jnani continues to see the world but sees the world as Self or being one with the Self
In truth, there is no connection between the Self on one hand, and ignorance/the world/the body on the other hand, the latter not really existing, and only appearing to exist due to ignorance
The world also refers to all movement or action (karma), and this action or karma only appears or arises due to ignorance.
Because karma or action is downstream from ignorance, in that ignorance is the cause of action, action cannot remove ignorance.
Like action, desire also arises from ignorance, and so in self-realisation there is no desire, as ignorance, which is the cause of all desire, no longer exists.
Similarly, all of time and space are products of ignorance and so time and space cease once ignorance has been removed (seen to have never existed)
Similarly, all of samsara, the cycle of birth, death and rebirth, is due to ignorance and this entire process starting from birth no longer appears when our true nature (Self) has been realised. This is ajata vada – that birth or creation never really ever occurred in the first place, not even as an appearance.
Let us see some quotes from the writings of Suresvara:
Therefore all this (world-appearance) comes forth from ignorance (ajnana) ~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi, preamble to 2.45
and that non-self is ignorance (or duality):
‘For the very nature of the not-self is ignorance‘ ~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi, preamble to 3.1
and again that the non-self is created by ignorance:
Further, the not-self is born of ignorance. ~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi, preamble to 3.1
and that ignorance is not actually a ‘thing’ at all:
…for ignorance is nothing but absence of knowledge, and since the latter is a non-entity (avastu) by nature… ~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi, preamble to 3.7
In NS, in his introduction to Chapter 3 he writes the following:
‘We have shown at some length that all this [world] from the Creator [Brahma] to a clump of grass, consisting of the empirical [relatie] knower, his instruments of knowledge, his knowledge and its objects, is but a false [unreal or untrue] superimposition. And it has been made clear that the Self is the changeless rock-firm Consciousness, void of the six states of phenomenal existence beginning with birth – and is that [changeless consciusness void of objects] alone. And between the world (as false superimposition) and the rock-firm Self there is no connection except ignorance (ajnana) [which itself is unreal]…’
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi, introduction to chapter 3
See how Suresvara gives the same teaching as his Guru, Shankara, by clearly stating that the Self is changeless and void of all phenomenal happenings. The phrase ‘beginning with birth’ emphasises that all phenomenal arisings right from their very outset are denied or non-arising in the Self.
Indeed, there is never any real contact between the Self and the body, far less between the Self and objects.
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 1.19
How can there be no contact between Self and objects? Only if the latter does not actually exist in any way, shape, arising or form! As he says in Chapter 2:
‘The Self is changeless consciousness, and therefore does not contain the factors of action.’
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 2.113
Suresvara is stating that the factors of action are not present in the Self – the factors of action are the doer/agent, the deed/action performed and the instrument through which it is performed. Everything we see/feel/perceive is in the field of action, of cause and effect. Suresvara is stating none of these exist in the Self. We see this same teaching here:
For Self-knowledge is based on the self-revealed reality alone, and its nature is to destroy ignorance and the whole complex of factors of action that arise from it as effects.
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 1.35
Here again we see the notion that ignorance is the cause of the body, mind and world, which are its effects. Both Shankara and Suresvara repeatedly state that when ignorance is destroyed by Self-Knowledge, the effects of ignorance, namely all phenomenal arisings, are also destroyed, just as the illusory snake is destroyed when the rope is clearly seen as rope. Suresvara continues in the same verse as follows restating that action depends on ignorance for both its existance and continuation once it has arisen:
But action depends on ignorance both for its rise and (for the production of its effects) after it has arisen. For action is but a means resorted to by some agent. It does not maintain itself independently after its own component factors (agent, instrument, object etc.) have all disappeared
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 1.35
Suresvara states this more succinctly here in his preamble to 1.40:
Action arises from ignorance, it ceases with the destruction of ignorance.
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi, preamble to 1.40
Action itself arises from nescience, hence it cannot destroy it. But right knowledge can destroy nescience for it is the opposite of it, as the sun is the oppositeof darkness.
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 1.35
Here is it very directly stated that there is no action or movement when ignorance is destroyed, as action is a consequence or effect of ignorance. Next we will see Suresvara stating that the teacher, the texts and the seeker are all illusions that do not exist in self-realisation – the teacher and teaching are the part of the illusion that take us out of illusion, and, being unreal, they do not persist with self-realisation:
In the same way, one who was ignorant of the Self and who is awakened from this ignorance by the Vedic text (sruti) sees nothing other than his own Self. The Teacher (guru), the texts and he himself as deluded individual soul have all disappeared.
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 4.37
In verse 43 of the same chapter Suresvara introduces the idea that it is our desire that creates/causes what is calls the ocean of suffering in verse 1.37 and what is here referred to as samsara, the cycle of birth-death-rebirth-suffering (also called transmigration):
Sruti has also declared this [teaching] in order to demolish desire (kama). All samsara has desire for its root.The destruction of desire arises from the destruction of ignorance.
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 1.43
The implication is that ignorance causes desire, which in turn creates or manifests the phenomenal arisings, similar to what we read in the karma kanda portion of the Vedas as well as the ‘new age’ Law of Attraction teachings. Suresvara quotes from Sruti to back this statement up:
“When all the desires that lie in a man’s heart are resolved.” (then the mortal becomes immortal and attains Brahman): “thus (does the man who desires transmigrate; but the man who does not desire never transmigrates)”. So says the Brhadaranyaka Upanishad [in verses 4.4.6 and 4.4.7]. Vyasa also spoke of this, as in “this our bondage is verily bondage through desire”
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 1.44
We can see that that idea of samsara, or transmigration, which consists of (the illusion of) being born as a person, then living and experiencing the joys and pains of life, eventually dying, and then repeating the process by being born again – this entire samsara is the phenomenal arising that we see, also known as suffering, that appears to appear in ‘our’ consciousness – all of this samsara is due to desire -ie. our desires manifest or project or create phenomenal arisisings such as bodies, minds, creatures and things. Desire itself is a consequence of ignorance, and when ignorance ceases, all the effects of ignorance, namely all desire and samsara, which is to say the entire mind and all phenomenal arisings, also cease.
It seems that Suresvara was likely reading or referring to Shankara’s commentary on the Brihadaranyaka Upanishad when he wrote the above verse, as Shankara writes the following:
They do not also know the contradiction, based on incongruity, between the attainment of knowledge, which obliterates all action with its factors and results, and ignorance together with its effects. [ie. all objects, duality, actions and suffering are removed with liberation, so there is no possibility of either desire or an object to desire in liberation] Nor have they heard Vyāsa’s statement (on the subject). The contradiction rests on the opposite trends of the nature of rites and that of knowledge, which are related to ignorance and illumination respectively.
~ Sri Shankara, Commentary on Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, introduction to section 2.4
We see Shankara say the the following in his commentary on Brihadaranyaka Upanishad about desires not being present in the Jnani, that is actually just the Self devoid of all illusion/arisings/birth.
But there are some who hold that even a knower of Brahman has desires. They have certainly never heard the Bṛhadāraṇyaka Upaniṣad[which states the Jnani has no desires]
~ Sri Shankara, Commentary on Brihadaranyaka Upanishad, introduction to section 2.4
Here in this next verse Suresvara says the following:
The sphere of ignorance is the unreal; the sphere of knowledge is the highest reality : conjunction between the two is like conjunction between the sun and the night.
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 1.56
And again here:
We have shown that action is an effect of ignorance, and that therefore there can be no association, either simultaneous or even successive, between knowledge and action
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi, peramble to verse 1.76
We can see here Suresvara is stating that, just as when the sun rises nighttime cannot exist in any way, similarly the unreal cannot exist in any way in self-realisation, which is the highest reality. Note that this is essentially the same as when Sri Ramana writes in ‘Who am I?’:
Therefore, when the world appears, Self will not appear; and when Self appears (shines), the world will not appear.
~ Sri Ramana Maharshi, ‘Who Am I?’
and
Question 4. When will the realisation of the Self be gained? Sri Ramana: When the world, which is what-is-seen, has been removed, there will be realisation of the Self, which is the seer
Question 5. Will there not be realisation of the Self even while the world is there? Sri Ramana: There will not be
~ Sri Ramana Maharshi, ‘Who Am I?’ (Question and Answer version)
Suresvara makes the point there can be no identification whatsoever with the body-mind for the self-realised one:
The Self-realized man cannot identify himself with the individual body and mind, since such identification is due to demoniac (Asuric) ignorance. If the latter had power to afflict even the man of Self-realization, knowledge of the Absolute would be useless.
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 1.75
This is because there is no body-mind and world for the self-realised one, who is nothing but the pure objectless formless self. The notion that the Jnani has a body, a mind, and engages in actvities, in birth and death, is only from the ignorant point of view of the ‘onlooker’, none of which exist in truth if we investigate who we are. Here are some more verses from Suresvara on this topic, all taken from Naishkarmya Siddhi:
Preamble to 2.30: When the ego-limitation is removed, nothing in the whole range of duality is left standing, since that is the sole root of our relation with duality. So we proceed:
2.30 When the ego-sense ceases, the sense of possession, too, departs; for the ego-sense is its only cause. Can there be (the appearance of) a false snake except when it is dark?
2.31 It is only he whose mind is afflicted by darkness who sees a snake in a rope through error. Therefore noone sees a snake in a garland except through error
2.32 If the ego-sense were really a property of the Self it would continue after liberation and in deep sleep. Since it does not do so, we conclude that it is a property of something else.
2.44 Thus we have shown that this duality is different from the Self – this duality which is false, which has no definable essence, whose cause is ignorance and whose nature is hard to understand by mere reasoning.
Preamble to 2.51: Nor does this whole illusory display (abhasa), consisting in action, its factors and results, touch the supreme reality in any way, since it is founded in mere delusion.
2.61 If the Self of man changes with the rise of every new idea in his intellect, that Self is non-eternal; but if the Self does not change, it cannot be the knower of that cognition.”
2.63 The notion that the changeless Self can be an experiencer is due to an error set up by the ego-sense; it is like the notion that mountains are moving due to the error set up by the motion of a boat.
Preamble to 2.69: Thus this pure consciousness, “firm as a mountain peak” (kutastha), has no contact with duality whatever
2.93 This formless non-dual Absolute (Brahman) is conceived in millions of ways by those of weak intellect, like the blind men guessing at the nature of the elephant.
2.119 So saying, he pronounces “OM” and becomes awake to the partless Self, beyond action and the factors of action. He acquires the solitary state, estranged as it were from the intellect, the body and the external objects.
Suresvara explains many other points in his text, such as the nature of ignorance and the method of self realisation, and he repeats these teachings that I have given above elsewhere in the text too, but I think the point is hopefully made that Suresvara’s view is very clear, and in accordance with his Guru, Sri Shankara, as well as with Gaudapada and the Upanishads, namely that there are no phenomenal arisings whatsoever in the Self, not even as an appearance. It is not that there is the Self, and there is the non-self, and these two never meet, for this would be highly dualistic – it is that there is only self, and in truth (which is ‘seen’ in self-realisation) there has never been non-self at any time. This is also explained in this article here with respect to the three levels of the teaching (sristi-dristi vada, dristi-sristi vada and ajata vada).
This is the true meaning of ajata vada, and this cannot be understood by the mind, which has completely perished (or ‘seen’ never to have arisen, a bit like the snake in the rope although that analogy too falls short as it appears that the snake did arise for a point in time, but actually ajata is even more radical and unfathomable than this!) in Self-Realisation. As suresvara states, ignorance has never really ever occurred:
When the Self is pure knowledge by nature, void of the factors of knower, knowing and known, how could there be the faintest possibility of the existence of ignorance therein?
~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 3.112
Here is a different point that Suresvara makes, that reasoning and intellectual knowledge alone will not lead to eradication of ignorance (and the subsequent or simultaneous self-knowledge)
The knowledge that the intellect, etc are not-self may be attained through reasoning. But reasoning does not suffice to annihilate ignorance. ~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 3.33
Here Suresvara states that Self-knowledge or removal of ignorance only can happen once, and when that happen, no time and space (and therefore no phenomenal arisings) and no samsara remain:
Through knowledge of reality he brings empirical being (samsara) to a complete end. Right-knowledge destroys the path of renunciation as surely as it destroys the path of action. ~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 4.56
By merely rising once, this (knowledge) destroys all becoming, through negation of ignorance once and for all. There is no more wrong knowledge afterwards. ~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 4.57
Time and space, etc., are the effects of delusion, and do not inhere in the Self. Once the Self is known, there is no more knowledge to gain and no ignorance left unconsumed. ~ Sri Suresvara, Naishkarmya Siddhi 4.58
This article is an excerpt from a much longer article which you can view here, that gives further quotes on this same topic from others including Sri Ramana Maharshi, Sri Shankara, Yoga Vasistha and Ribhu Gita. The original article also expands on the disclaimer and makes some suggestions as how to best appraoch these teachings.
In this Satsang moment, a participant shares a challenging and illuminating exchange from Sri Ramana Maharshi’s Upadesa Manjari (Spiritual Instruction). Tom offers a spontaneous teaching that invites us to deeply contemplate Bhagavan’s insight into our desire for happiness, and gently supports the inner healing process required as we open to liberation and the lasting joy we truly seek.
This video was recorded live during a Satsang meeting with Tom Das on November 20th, 2025 and put together by volunteers.
Tom Das 