How can the Jnani (sage) function with NO THOUGHTS? Sri Ramana Maharshi

Also see: Ramana Maharshi: The world should be considered like a dream

Question: I often read references in Ramana Maharshi’s writings of the need for ALL thought to be removed or extinguished. Is this a translation error? Perhaps he means that only egoic or self-referential thoughts need to be removed? If all thoughts are removed, how could he teach others?

Tom: The need to remove all thoughts seems to be a very strange teaching indeed, and the objection you raise is a common-sense and valid one. However Sri Ramana was very clear that he meant ALL thoughts should be removed. Note this is also known as Samadhi, Turiya or Wakeful-Sleep (Jagrat-Susupti).

eg. In his short text ‘Who am I?’ Ramana writes:

‘The thought ‘Who am I?’, destroying all other thoughts, will itself finally be destroyed like the stick used for stirring the funeral pyre.’

‘As and when thoughts rise, one should annihilate all of them through enquiry then and there in their very place of origin.’

Nowhere in the vedanta teachings do we see any mention of only ‘self-referential thoughts’ needing to be removed, and with good reason too – only when all thoughts are removed will the Reality Shine. Otherwise ignorance will find a way to continue.

We see the same teaching in the Vedanta scriptures such as in the Upanishads, the Bhagavad Gita, the writings of Gaudapada and of Shankara.

As to how can a Guru teach if he/she has no thoughts, the essential response is that from the point of view of ignorance it seems that Ramana is a body-mind entity (ie. a human being or person) that thinks, acts and suffers, but In Reality Sri Ramana is not a body mind at all – he is the Ultimate Reality – the Self, and it is only from the point of view of ignorance that he seems to move and act and think, etc.

Ramana sometimes said that he couldn’t think a single thought even if he tried! Oh, the paradox!

All thoughts must be removed (by Self-Enquiry)

The text Guru Vachaka Kovai is said to be the most authoritative recording of Sri Ramana’s verbal teachings. Here are some verses on the need to extinguish all thoughts:

  1. Unless the noise of thoughts subsides
    One cannot know the ineffable bliss
    Of mouna.
  1. True wealth is but the gracious silence
    Of steady, unswerving Siva-awareness.
    This bright, rare treasure can be gained
    Only by those who earnestly
    Strive for extinction of all thoughts

(Tom: ie. for liberation, one must earnestly strive for the extinction of ALL thoughts)

  1. Siva, who is Pure Awareness
    Transcending thought, is only known
    To seers heroic who with minds
    Extinct abide thought-free
    The heart, and not to those whose minds
    Are still engaged in thought

(Tom: ie. Liberation is not known to those who are still engaged in thought. One must abide with ‘minds extinct’ and ‘thought-free’)

  1. The mark of bhakti true, total
    Self-surrender at Siva’s Feet,
    Is perfect peace without a thought
    Or word of prayer or plaint.

(Tom: ie. True Bhakti, which is the same as True Jnana, also has no thoughts within it)

How does a sage function with no thoughts? The Jnani (Sage) does not act or think or perceive any differences (The Unfathomable nature of the Sage)

And here are some verses describing the unfathomable nature of Liberation/Jnana/The Jnani:

  1. “The mukta [liberated sage] like the rest of us perceives
    The world in all its vast variety
    And yet he sees non-difference in it”,
    So people say. This is not true.

(Tom: ie. the idea that the liberated sage still perceives differences ‘like the rest of us’ but perceives an underlying unity despite various objects being seen is here being refuted.)

  1. Those who mistakenly perceive
    The variegated universe believe
    The mukta too is a perceiver like them
    But he is not the perceiver.

(Tom: ie. Taking yourself, in ignorance, to be a perceiver and doer, one also, in ignorance, takes the sage to be a perceiver and doer. The notion that the sage is not a perceiver at all is one we find throughout the vedanta scriptures, but how can the mind understand this?)

  1. Ascribing individual being
    To realised muktas is sheer folly
    Their being is universal Being.
    The separateness seen in that pure
    Sky is but the shadow cast
    By the separateness of lookers-on
    Still bound.

  1. In that great Silence there is no
    Sense of difference. But is there then
    A feeling of non-difference? No.

    The non-duality extolled
    By Seer’s is nothing but the absence
    Of all sense of difference.

(Tom: here Sri Ramana states explicitly that the sage perceives no difference whatsoever, and feels no differences whatsoever. How can this be?! All difference is an effect of ignorance only!)

But do we not see the sage eating, doing things and suffering?

1135 & 1136. Even if the sense of doership
Is dead, “How could one call the sage
A mukta freed from all the bonds
Of karma? Do we not see him eating,
Engaged in work, bearing a body
Of flesh
, accepting prarabdha [destiny],
And suffering pain?” If you ask this,
The answer is, “True, in your sight
He seems to suffer, you see him suffering,
But did he tell you that he suffered?

1137 The sage enjoys as his own being
The bliss of all transcendent Being.
The error lies in these ignorant folk
Seeing him as a body that suffers

1152. Beyond the reach of words extends
The sage’s greatness.
None but he
Can know his state of Being, vaster
Than the sky and than the mountain
Firmer. To experience it
Yourself, you should first shed your own

(Tom: Oh the wonder and unfathomable nature of Self-Realisation! No matter how many times we hear the state of Moksha described, know it cannot be understood! It is truly beyond the mind! How lucky we are to have Sri Ramana’s Presence and Teachings to guide us!)

Blessings and Namaste


To understand this in greater detail, please read the PDF here

7 thoughts on “How can the Jnani (sage) function with NO THOUGHTS? Sri Ramana Maharshi

  1. Is this in the “different orders of reality” area i.e. I can do the maths and discern that if all is one then there can be no thought – in the same way as there can be no Earth or Galaxies, but in pedagogical terms are we English speakers missing a word to clearly distinguish dysfunctional thought from what seems to perhaps not be thought – more like knowledge appearing without words e.g. adjusting the body if/when its noted that it was in an unnecessary and uncomfortable posture – there would be some mental process involved and it seems that any words involved are unnecessary additions. Either way this was instructive material drawing attention to the silence from which thoughts emerge.


Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: Logo

You are commenting using your account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.